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4.1 UPnP support ... Sonos?
#21
paradise Wrote:Couldn't you leave a "Sonos Media Renderer Driver" if you created an enhanced "Sonos Control Driver"?

I think the beauty of Sonos is that it takes care of everything. Using it as a generic media renderer would only be useful to a small number of users IMHO...

Yes, Paradise, you have nailed it. And I came to the same conclusion in talking with Dean off line. Dean wants to keep all media renderers the same for generic widgetization--fine and good for those who care. I'm with you that those of us who love sonos and their multiple controllers will not want to replicate that browsing and repositorying and rendering via cqc. Way too painful.

The key distinction is we want control of our sonos devices at a higher level, but we don't need the ability to queue a specific song or album to it as per the repo+ media renderer paradigm.

We want to be able to take control of sonos to switch source, from whatever it is currently playing to line-in (which could be from a cqc server running text to speech). We want to be able to read and save state from the sonos before switching to line-in and to be able to restore roughly the state after we are switch back from line-in. We want to do this to highjack the numerous sonos zoneplayers/amplifers/speakers throughout the house to play annoucements. This implies being able to read the state of zone player groups, save that state, join all zones together, switch source of all to line-in, change volume, unmute all zones (possibly dependent on zone-specific do-not-disturb flags), play the message via line-in, and then return zones to their prior groups with their respective sources and respective volumes and play states.

We realized that this has NOTHING to do with repository and rendering, so there is no need to think of this breaking the cqc repo/render paradigm.

As you (more concisely than this) put it, this is a matter of SONOS CONTROL, not an issue of stretching the current (standardized) media renderers to accomodate the rich functionality of sonos.

The cool thing is that some of it is already available (mute, volume, pause, play, stop)!

I would love to hear (and I would think Dean would to) other thoughts from the sonos users out there. Maybe Paradise and I are the only two who are interested but I think there are lots more out there (there are hundreds of posts that include the word "Sonos" on this forum which is interesting given that that cqc does not support sonos...they are mostly requests of some form. And Sonos does $250,000,000 per year in sales.

Do you
A) want to use the media repo to queue up and play specific songs/albums through sonos...or do you

B) want higher level control of sonos to enable whole-house annunciation even if it means no rendering of cqc repo items?
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#22
ControlFreak Wrote:Maybe Paradise and I are the only two who are interested but I think there are lots more out there
there may be the only few of us Sonos guys left... everyone else moved on to easier to control audio devices...

ControlFreak Wrote:(there are hundreds of posts that include the word "Sonos" on this forum which is interesting given that that cqc does not support sonos...
to be fair, at least half of those (probably much much more than half) are from the 2006 to 2008 time frame when I was repeatedly annoying Dean with the equivalent of annoying "Are we there yet" type posts about sonos:oops:

ControlFreak Wrote:Do you
A) want to use the media repo to queue up and play specific songs/albums through sonos...or do you

B) want higher level control of sonos to enable whole-house annunciation even if it means no rendering of cqc repo items?
FWIW, this is the perfect thing to break into its own post as a poll... (although not really necessary if its just the 3 of us...)
but me personally, I would prefer more of a "command & control" type driver...
but the current C&C capabilities gets me most of the way there... at least my Lex now turns on and switches to the Sonos input when the ZP80 is playing...
NOTE: As one wise professional something once stated, I am ignorant & childish, with a mindset comparable to 9/11 troofers and wackjob conspiracy theorists. so don't take anything I say as advice...
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#23
I use Sonos at our vacation homes that have multiroom audio only. There is no other automation to control, so sonos is the perfect system. To replicate Sonos' control paradigm in CQC would be a massive undertaking, and honestly I mostly listen to Pandora, Last.FM, rhpasody etc most of the time anyway. To me my music library has become a backup, not the front stage.

If it were me, I would have loved to be able to plop down a bunch of ZonePlayers in my new house and have multiple streams of pandora, my library etc all work out of the box. Ideally I would just have the sonos iPad app embedded as a page of my CQC control but I don't think that's an option.

As it sits now, I have a couple of squeezeboxes to play my internet radio, those feed two 6x6 switchers which then feed two multi channel amps which feed the speakers.

With Sonos, I could just have a ZP for each zone and be done (and have the possibilty for more unique streams...

Long story short, in my ideal world CQC could let me choose a source per device, group and ungroup pause play etc on Sonos
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#24
paradise Wrote:Long story short, in my ideal world CQC could let me choose a source per device, group and ungroup pause play etc on Sonos
that is pretty much what I would call a command & control type driver...

on a side note/random thought of the day: assuming the current sonos driver is written in CML, the hard part is done, and it should be easy enough for someone to take that and modify it to be more C&C like and less Repo Renderer' like...
NOTE: As one wise professional something once stated, I am ignorant & childish, with a mindset comparable to 9/11 troofers and wackjob conspiracy theorists. so don't take anything I say as advice...
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#25
It's currently a C++ driver because the UPnP stuff isn't exposed to CML.
Dean Roddey
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#26
I should have a first cut of a Sonos specific driver in the next beta drop. I've been doing a crazy bunch of digging into UPnP and the Sonos specific UPnP classes and I have a lot of functionality in place. I just need now to corral it into a driver which I've started on.
Dean Roddey
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#27
I've been banging away hard on this driver for the last few days. I've wasted a lot of time today on what appears to be a bug in the MS UPNP framework. It doesn't pass along events that indicte that a container has changed. I was setting up the driver to keep up with the current queue and currently available list of playlists. The device reports changes, I see them in the Intel Device Spy, but they don't make it to me in my program, so I have no way to check for changs other than by polling which I don't want to do particularly.

For the immediate term the reason for tracking the list of playlists is so that I can provide you with a 'load playlist by name' type of command, which requires that I go through all the available playlists and find the one with that name and load it. So I wanted to keep an up to date list in the driver. But I guess I can hack it in another way. Oh well...

Otherwise, I've got a pretty nice first cut at a driver going. I'm going to do this small hack and then move on to do a couple other fixes then get a new drop out.
Dean Roddey
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#28
Hmmm.... Maybe it's the Sonos, here is someone complaining of the same thing, but he sees it getting to Windows at a low level but not being reported and that this changed at some Sonos firmware version for him. Of course no one answered, since there are never answers for the things that I end up getting stumped on it seems:

http://forums.sonos.com/showthread.php?t=23530
Dean Roddey
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#29
I started a new thread for discussion/refinement of the Sonos specific driver, the first cut of which is in the 4.1.908 beta I just posted.

http://www.charmedquark.com/vb_forum/sho...post137700
Dean Roddey
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