Installing CQC Software on a HP t5720/t5720 Thin Client

[sic0048]

The purpose of this thread is to give a "how to" tutorial on installing the CQC IV on a HP t57xx series thin client. These devices run XPe and have flash memory where you can load in the IV and run it as a stand alone device. In other words, you will not have to use this device as a RDP client, but should be able to run the IV directly from the thin client. The power draw is also very low for these devices. Some of our own users have measured the power usage of the t5700 units using the Brultech monitor and they found it draws approx 12 watts during the boot process and drops down to about 9 watts when at idle.

I couple of things to note. First, there are several versions of the t57xx series and each version has multiple configurations. It has been recommended that you use a version that has 512mb flash memory and 256mb ram or more if you have a t5700 and 512mb/512mb minimum if you have a t5720. The good news is that both the flash memory and the ram seems to be fairly easy to upgrade. Here is a good article on upgrading your unit (http://www.mazda-speed.com/forum2/index.php?;topic=14957.0). If you have a t5700, just be aware that the unit will not accept a RAM module larger than 512mb, so don't try to use a larger module.

Here is the official HP support page for the t5700 (http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareIndex.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodNameId=379363&prodTypeId=12454&prodSeriesId=339208&swLang=13&taskId=135&swEnvOID=1058). It includes drivers for some touchscreens (such as the ELO and 3M drivers) as well as a full XPe SP2 OS in case you need to upgrade or reflash the unit for some reason. Here is the User Manual for the t5000 series thin clients. (http://bizsupport.austin.hp.com/bc/docs/support/SupportManual/c00572312/c00572312.pdf)

I should give a special thanks to CQC user lesbib. He already has the IV running on the t57xx and has given a lot of good information about how to accomplish this. So while I may be the one writing this "How To" up, a lot of the actual information came directly from lesbib.

This is the discussion thread (http://www.charmedquark.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=7242). Please use this thread for any discussion and do not reply in the "How To" forum.

[sic0048]

Installing a clean XPe image
This step may not be required depending on your device. But if you are unsure how the device has been used in the past, or if you know the image has been modified from its original form, you will want to install a new XPe image to have a clean slate to start with. For example, the units purchased during the group buy were originally used by USAirways and had a custom image that included some proprietary software. Therefore it required a new XPe image to clean everything up and make sure we had all the XPe parts that we needed.

To start, download the XPe image from the HP website (http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareIndex.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodNameId=379363&prodTypeId=12454&prodSeriesId=339208&swLang=13&taskId=135&swEnvOID=1058). Scroll down the page until you find the "Operating System - Enhancements and QFEs" section and click on the download button. (For a t5720 device use this XPe image (http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareDescription.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodTypeId=12454&prodSeriesId=1809592&swItem=vc-65161-1&prodNameId=1809593&swEnvOID=1058&swLang=13&taskId=135&mode=4&idx=0) - the t5700 version does not work on the t 5720). You want to download this to a computer other than the thin client. We will create a bootable USB drive to actually install the OS on the thin client. Once the file is downloaded, install the program on your computer and run it. It will give you the option of creating a ISO file, a bootable USB drive, or unpacking the contents in the directory of your choice. I couldn't find my USB drive anywhere, so I ended up burning a CD and using my USB CD/DVD drive. After creating a CD or USB drive, here are the steps you need to take:
Connect the USB device to the thin client
Restart the thin client and enter the Setup menu by pressing F10 when directed
Choose "Advance BIOS Features" from the menu
Make sure the First Boot Device is set to [USB]
Exit and save (Press ESC and then F10 - per the directions on the screen)
Allow the thin client to continue to boot normally
When asked if you want to restore the OS image and over write the flash memory, select "Y" and confirm
Allow the thin client to load the new image - this takes some time to complete
After the image is finished loading, reboot the thin client and allow it to complete the restore process. This takes approximately 5-10 minutes and your screen will likely be a black screen for the first couple of minutes. The thin client is really working, so make sure you leave it alone. Eventually it will reboot and enter the normal XP desktop.

Reflashing the OS to XPe SP2 is a super easy task. Other than creating the boot device (Cd or USB drive) the process is pretty much automatic.

The Enhanced Write Filter Manager
Before we start trying to modify the OS to allow the IV to be loaded on to the flash drive, we need to understand a little about how the flash drive works. Under normal conditions, there is an "Enhanced Write Filter Manager" (EWFM) that provides a secure environment for thin-client computing by protecting the thin client from undesired flash memory writes (the operating system and functional software components reside in flash memory). The write filter also extends the life of the thin client by preventing excessive flash write activity. It gives the appearance of read-write access to the flash by employing a cache to intercept all flash writes and returning success to the process that requested the I/O.

The intercepted flash writes that are stored in cache are available as long as the thin client remains active, but are lost when you reboot or shut down the unit. To preserve the results of writes to the registry, favorites, cookies, and so forth, you can transfer the contents of the cache to the flash on demand using the Altiris Deployment Solution software or manually using the EWFM.

For our purposes of adding the IV, we'll manually disable the EWFM, so that all future writes during the current boot session are written to the flash with no further caching until reboot. Just remember to re-enable the EWFM after you have made all of your permanent changes or simply reboot the unit before resuming normal activities.

To do this take these steps:
1. Log in as an administrator. Press the 'start' button, and press the "Log Off" button. When the "Log Off Windows" popup appears, hold the 'shift' key and select 'log off' and continue holding the shift button down. This will bring up the log in screen. Enter in User=Administrator & Pwd=Administrator and log back in. If you don't hold the shift button long enough, the thin client will log back into the User profile automatically.
2. Right click the EWFM icon in the system tray (it is the icon that looks like a lock and will probably been green and appear to be locked.
3. Select "Enable" to turn the manager on and prevent permanent writes to the flash memory. Select "Disable" to turn the filter off and allow permanent writes to the flash memory.
4. The thin client should ask to be rebooted. Go ahead and do this. When the system reboots, the lock in the system tray should be open and red in color if the EWFM is disabled.


You can also permanently write to the flash memory by using some simply command lines. This can be useful if you forget to turn off the EWFM and start making some changes. You can "commit" these changed to permanent memory without having to reboot and start over. To do this:
1. Make any changes that you want to save/commit to permanent memory
2. Open the Command Line Prompt (Start > Run > Open > and type in "CMD" in the open field and click "OK")
3. Type ewfmgr c: -commit
4. Other commands include "-disable" which turn off the EWFM filter and "-enable" which turns on the EWFM filter and "-all" which shows the current status of the memory volumes.


Adding Files to the XPe OS - (this step is not required if you have a t5720 and are using the latest XPe version from the HP site).
We need to add a couple of files from the regular XP OS to the XPe OS that is installed on the thin client. The IV installer requires these files and they are normally not installed with XPe. The two files are attrib.exe & dbghelp.dll. They are located in the Windows/System32 folder of a regular XP installation and need to be saved in the same folder on the thin client. Again, make sure you have disabled the EWFM before trying to save these files.

Turning off the HP Sygate Security Agent Firewall
By default, there is a firewall that starts up to "protect" your thin client. However, it seems to prevent communication between the CQC Client and CQC server. So we need to disable the software before trying to install CQC. Log in as Administrator
Right click the Sygate icon in the system tray (it looks like two arrows - one pointing up and one pointing down).
Select "Options"
Under the General tab, uncheck the "Automatically load HP Sygate Security Agent service at startup
Right click the Sygate icon again
Choose "Disable Sygate Security Agent"
Right click the Sygate icon again
Choose "Exit Sygate Agent" and acknowledge.

Optionally, you can remove the Sygate program and even install the Windows Firewall if you feel the need to run a firewall in your situation. Directions on doing this can be found below or in this HP support document (http://bizsupport.austin.hp.com/bc/docs/support/SupportManual/c00572312/c00572312.pdf).

Installing CQC
Now that the EWFM and the Sygate Security program have been disabled, we are ready to install CQC. I ended up moving the installation folder directly to the thin client and installing from there. I did this just to make sure there is enough room to do this. I had no trouble using this method. But you could install from a USB drive, network location, etc. Whatever method you are comfortable with should work fine.

I got a couple of "missing files" notices immeditately after invoking the installer, but the system continued on and I was able to finish the installation without any problems. In my personal situation, I decided to install the IV, the admin interface, and the CQCServer. I had no problems installing or running any of these items. However, several people has experienced a situation where the installer simply quits before finishing (it simply ends without warning or any errors). If this happens to you, please download a new installation package from the CQC site and try again. Most people have gotten through the installation process on the second try if the first try failed. I cannot explain why some people have a problem and others don't. I'm not entirely convinced it is a problem with the thin clients. It could be a corrupt download (ie missing a few bits of information).

After rebooting and opening the IV interface and admin interface and opening a couple of IV screens that have an imbedded internet pages on them, browsing my CD repo, etc, my memory maxed out at 209 mb. So it seems that it will run everything on 256mb. I've checked the flash drive and it seems to only have about 226mb used (after I deleted the installation folder) and 286mb free. It has not been confirmed yet if you can load CQC on only 256mb flash, but there is plenty of room left over for touch screen drivers, etc when you use 512mb flash. In fact, adding more space than 512mb purely overkill for a dedicated CQC device.

If you have installed CQC using the "Stand Alone IV" version, you may need to add the "/Standalone" switch in the IV startup line (found by right clicking the IV icon and selecting "properties").

[sic0048]

Success!
Here is a picture of a LCD display that is hooked up to my HP Thin Client t5700. It shows both the IV and AV up and running as well as the task manager on screen showing the current memory usage (208mb).

You can also see some of the system icons that are unique to the thin client. The EWFM is the green lock which tells us it is currently enabled to prevent writes directly to the flash drive and the Sygate software icon has the yellow warning flag to show us that it is currently disabled.

http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x46/sic0048/HPThinClientSmall.jpg

Autobooting into the Administrator User
This is an optional step, but one I would recommend. I believe the thin clients are set to automatically log into the "User" windows user. This user is not defined as an Admin user and therefore has limited function. I changed my thin client to automatically log into the "Administrator" windows login which has Admin rights and full function. To make this change permanent:
Disable the EWFM to make these changes permanent
Log into the Administrator log in
Open the control panel and click on Adminstrative Tools.
Open the Automatic Login program.
Change the automatic login user from "User" to "Administator" with the password "Administrator"
Reboot and enable on the EWFM to prevent unneccessary writes to the flash memory (or type ewfmgr c: -commit from the command prompt prior to rebooting if the EWFM was not disabled in the first step).

The thin client should boot into the Administrator user each time it is rebooted now.

Removing Unneccessary Programs from the Thin Client
Optionally, you can also remove some of the programs that are automatically installed on the HP thin client that will not effect the CQC installation. These progams are things like the ICA Citrix server, TeamNT, Microsoft Media Player (leave installed if you plan on using a media player driver on this machine), and the HP Spygate Security Agent (which we already disabled).

HP has several removal programs that allow you to remove these programs easily and completely and without otherwise effecting the XPe image. So go to the HP web site (http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareIndex.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodNameId=379363&prodTypeId=12454&prodSeriesId=339208&swLang=13&taskId=135&swEnvOID=1058) and browse the available programs. You are looking for those programs that have "Remove XXXX" in their name. There is also a multiple program removal tool (http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareDescription.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodTypeId=12454&prodSeriesId=339208&swItem=PSG_I22296-106766&prodNameId=379363&swEnvOID=1058&swLang=13&taskId=135&mode=4&idx=3) that allows you to remove most of the unneeded programs in one shot. You need to download the removal tool to another computer (not the thin client) and create a USB device, just like we did when we reflashed the main XPe image. Here are the directions:


1. Browse the HP Site (http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareIndex.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodNameId=379363&prodTypeId=12454&prodSeriesId=339208&swLang=13&taskId=135&swEnvOID=1058) and find the removal program you want to use, or use the multiple program removal tool (http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareDescription.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodTypeId=12454&prodSeriesId=339208&swItem=PSG_I22296-106766&prodNameId=379363&swEnvOID=1058&swLang=13&taskId=135&mode=4&idx=3)
2. Put the removal programs on a USB drive.
3. Make sure you are logged in as "Administrator" on the thin client and have the EWFM disabled (or plan on using the ewfmgr c: -commit command).
4. Plug the USB device into the thin client and run the removal program. This will extract the removal files onto the thin client
5. Go to the directory where you extracted the files to and run the .exe program listed. This will cause a bunch of windows to flash up.

Repeat steps 1-5 for as many of the removal programs as you would like to run


6. Reboot if the EWFM filter was disabled (or run "ewfmgr c: -commit" from the command prompt if it wasn't)
7. Delete the removal files that where extracted in step 4. The removal program does not remove these files automatically.
8. Enable the EWFM filter which should reboot the machine (or run "ewfmgr c: -commit" again from the command prompt if the EWFM filter is already on)


Removing these "extra" programs will help free up memory and resources. You can always reinstall a removed program if you need to by using the installation files found on the HP site instead of the removal files. So removing these files can always be easily reversed without having to reflash the entire XPe image. Therefore I would recommend that you remove as many of these files as you can to make the machine as lean as possible.

You can also add the Windows Firewall program by following these steps, but using the installation file found on the HP web site.

Summary
Installing CQC components on the HP t57** series is easy and provides a low power, small form, inexpensive device to run a CQC IV with. I would recommend looking at these units for your IV needs. Just don't expect it to provide the speed or processing power of a modern CPU chip. IE keep a realistic expectation of what these devices will accomplish. I also recommend reading the rest of this thread to see other user experiences to judge for yourself whether or not a thin client might be for you.

Discussion
If you have any questions or comments, please post on this thread. (http://www.charmedquark.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=7242) I've successfully installed CQC on several t5700's and several t5720's, so I've had decent experience working with these units now. Good luck.

[George M]

Has anyone here tried to use the MagicJack (VOIP Phone Unit) with the 5700. I know I was reading a thread of someone who was doing this, but I can't find it now. I tried but could not get it to use the phone. When I picked up the phone it sounded like an open line. I was on the phone with them for two hours all to no avial. They told me to install DIVX, which I could not do because it kept erroring out when installing files to the system32 directory.

Anyway, if someone has done this I would be interested in how.

George M

[Dean Roddey]

That kind of thing would be better discussed in the more general threads about this device. If it's worked out, a separate How-To could be done for it.

[sic0048]

Just happened to see an E-Bay listing (buy it now/best offer) (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=390019223512&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:US:1123) for a t5700 with good RAM and Flash. Shipping is 18.00 so total cost it going to be about $98 or less if the seller accepts a lower offer.

Not sure if anyone is still interested in these, but that is a decent price IMHO. I have no connection to the seller, but it came up on my E-Bay saved searches.

Seller has 8 available, so hopefully they are still available if you are interested.

[AnthonyZ]

Uh oh...I've just added the necessary files to System32 and changed the workgroup name on my HP to add into my system. Upon rebooting (to activate the new workgrup name) it brings up a DOS window with the following message...

FreeDOS FAT Kernal GO!

...and then hangs indefinitely. I've tried rebooting, loading factory defaults, everything. It still boots into the DOS window and the same message. Anyone else seen this? Know how to correct?

[sic0048]

I'd say you messed it up good :-)

Honestly the easiest thing to do is simply reflash it IMHO. You could spend hours trying to figure out how to fix it, or 30 minutes to reflash it and know that it is fixed.

[AnthonyZ]

Damn, Brian, as much help as you've given me in the last few days, I'd swear you're flirting.

Thanks again, I think you're right.

[AnthonyZ]

I'm dumb as a box of rocks. I was trying to boot with a USB fob in. D'oh! Pulled it and it booted right up...

[beelzerob]

I'm dumb as a box of rocks.

Nice to meet you! I'm more of the "dumb as a bag of hammers" variety myself. :-D

[bjkiller]

I like to be more green and devices that run 24/7 be fanless and eat less energy.
i using HP thin client for monowall - firewall and askozia (asterisk pbx). monowall and askozia (based on freebsd) and even with device 256mb ram, there used only 11-17%.

what about to run on such client CQC server, possible to upgrade it to 1Gb RAM. there special brand that work!

do possible install CQC Server on such unit? :-?

btw: I compiled askozia with curl (now very easy to integrate phone system with anything that have web interface - i already tried with Lutron HomeWorks, I beliave it's simple with CQC, but i still do not know CML) and g729 - if somebody need image - just PM.

[sic0048]

I am exploring this option right now due to some weird problems with my main CQC server which is an old P4 3.0 Ghz machine that is surely not very green.

I cannot see a reason why installing the CQC server on a thin client will not work. That being said, I am trying it on the t5720 which is slightly newer than the t5700. It allows a max RAM of 1gb while the older t5700 only allows 512mb RAM.

The biggest question is how many device drivers will I be able to add without slowing the machine down too much. I think the thin client will be able to handle the CQC server without a hickup, but if you read Deans FAQ about installing it, he recommends beefier systems when installing a "normal" amount of devices.

Medium Sized Controller. Here we assume a machine in the closet, running say 4 to 10 device drivers, running all the optional components, and acting as a server to a 4 to 8 standalone client nodes of various type (non-RDP.) This system should probably be somewhere in the range of a 2Ghz CPU, 512MB to 1GB of memory, and dual 40GB SATA RAID1 drives. If this machine is distributing metadata and streaming music, then you might want to go with a fast front side bus, like an 800Mhz or greater FSB machine. If it is running a media repository server, then you probably want 2GB of memory.


So I think that will be the biggest hang up. I plan on putting just a few "critical" device drivers on the thin client and leaving the rest on my P4 machine (which also acts as my SageTV server). I hope to have this up and running this weekend. So we'll see how it goes.

PS - I'd love to hear about your monowall/asterisk box. I've always wanted to try those, but thought it was too far out of my reach programing wise. To put that on a thin client is a great idea.

[bjkiller]

So I think that will be the biggest hang up. I plan on putting just a few "critical" device drivers on the thin client and leaving the rest on my P4 machine (which also acts as my SageTV server). I hope to have this up and running this weekend. So we'll see how it goes.



Currently I run SageTV+SqueezeCenter on separate heavy server from green point (dual core, 1GB RAM 500GB HD) connected to 6x DVB-S2 cards. My sagetv server serve 7 clients + SqueezeCenter also 6 zones.
In additional I have lime-technology.com storage for 15 disk (only 5 of 1Tb installed) pretty green - it's stops disks after 1h not usage.
Before 2 weeks, CQC server and SAGETV server shared same server, but SageTV is not perfect stable, becouse a lot of hardware(DVB-S2 cards). Also they release very frequantly betas. I afraid that TV (sagetv) can make troubles to my house control (CQC Server) and moved server CQC server to separate server slim dual core industrial computer 1GB RAM and flash 8GB sata disk($78). but this chasi have 2 fans, it's makes a lot of noise.
Month ago I installed monowall and askozia (and it's so silent on T5700), so I thought if your CQC uses only serial ports (I have 8 ports USB DIGI board - Nuvo GC, Caddx NX8e, Onkyo 906, 50" Fujitsu, Epson projector, termomether and possible others) and TCP things (SqueezeCenter, Lutron, Weather, Sage etc) so possible to run CQC on very green hardware like T5700 (becouse it's very single board computer - it's should be very realiable).

[sic0048]

Well I've determine that my t5720 must have a bad network NIC card. It never connects to the network and always times out and sets itself to the automatic IP connection. I've set everything up to use DHCP and get it's own IP adress, and also tried setting a specific IP address. Nothing works. From what I've read, if those items don't work, and it falls back to the automatic address you generally either have problems with the router (not mine since all other connections work fine) or a problems with the NIC. Since this was an E-Bay purchase, I'm leaning towards a NIC. So I'll have to get one to use with this machine before I can move forward. I'm looking at some USB NICs so I can still use the PCI slot for a serial port card.

[bjkiller]

Well I've determine that my t5720 must have a bad network NIC card. It never connects to the network and always times out and sets itself to the automatic IP connection. I've set everything up to use DHCP and get it's own IP adress, and also tried setting a specific IP address. Nothing works. From what I've read, if those items don't work, and it falls back to the automatic address you generally either have problems with the router (not mine since all other connections work fine) or a problems with the NIC. Since this was an E-Bay purchase, I'm leaning towards a NIC. So I'll have to get one to use with this machine before I can move forward. I'm looking at some USB NICs so I can still use the PCI slot for a serial port card.

when i installed monowall, i have issues with onboard nic card, "vr0 watchdog timeout", and voip from askozia was bad.
i search on google, it's something related to irq/acpi, i do not think it's nic itself problem.

I purchased on ebay dual intel card for $5 + S&H (10 or 11), i currently using both intel card ports on T5700 for monowall.
askozia T5700 has no issue with nic.

[Monk]

Well I've determine that my t5720 must have a bad network NIC card. It never connects to the network and always times out and sets itself to the automatic IP connection. I've set everything up to use DHCP and get it's own IP adress, and also tried setting a specific IP address. Nothing works. From what I've read, if those items don't work, and it falls back to the automatic address you generally either have problems with the router (not mine since all other connections work fine) or a problems with the NIC. Since this was an E-Bay purchase, I'm leaning towards a NIC. So I'll have to get one to use with this machine before I can move forward. I'm looking at some USB NICs so I can still use the PCI slot for a serial port card.
You mean the address you ended up with was like the 169.254.xxx.xxx auto assign addresss? Yes you could have a bad NIC but a fast way to determine is to manually set a static IP address. This assumes you already know the physical connections are good, etc. If you then have connectivity outside the box, the problem is DHCP related.

[sic0048]

You mean the address you ended up with was like the 169.254.xxx.xxx auto assign addresss? Yes you could have a bad NIC but a fast way to determine is to manually set a static IP address. This assumes you already know the physical connections are good, etc. If you then have connectivity outside the box, the problem is DHCP related.

I tried setting a fixed address and it reverted to the auto assigned address anyway. All the other devices on my network are functioning fine.

[bph]

I tried setting a fixed address and it reverted to the auto assigned address anyway. All the other devices on my network are functioning fine.

I'd be really surprised if that's a *hardware* error. More like a misconfiguration or a corrupted driver or something in the software. Hardware can't (shouldn't) overrride the Windows settings for IP address.

Do you have it configured to throw away changes to the configuration on each restart?

[bjkiller]

I'd be really surprised if that's a *hardware* error. More like a misconfiguration or a corrupted driver or something in the software. Hardware can't (shouldn't) overrride the Windows settings for IP address.

Do you have it configured to throw away changes to the configuration on each restart?

when i expirienced problem with thin client, i got packet lost.
like after 30,000 pings, i lost close 1%.

[sic0048]

I'd be really surprised if that's a *hardware* error. More like a misconfiguration or a corrupted driver or something in the software. Hardware can't (shouldn't) overrride the Windows settings for IP address.

Do you have it configured to throw away changes to the configuration on each restart?

Well what is happening is that the thin client is not finding the DHCP server (my router located at 192.168.1.1) and it is failing to the Automatic Private IP Address (APIPA). I've tried setting the thin client to use the DHCP server to get an IP address, and I've also tried setting a static IP address. Both ways failed and the device set itself to the APIPA. It has been suggested that I try to ping the local address 127.0.0.1 and check the results, but I have not hooked the thin client back up to try this yet.

I started with a fresh install of the XPe SP2 image from the HP website. So I would be surprised if it was a driver error. But I could always reflash the unit and see if that helps.

Any suggestions are more than welcome. I am not a network administrator, so a lot of these tips and tricks are unknown to me.

[Monk]

Well what is happening is that the thin client is not finding the DHCP server (my router located at 192.168.1.1) and it is failing to the Automatic Private IP Address (APIPA). I've tried setting the thin client to use the DHCP server to get an IP address, and I've also tried setting a static IP address. Both ways failed and the device set itself to the APIPA. It has been suggested that I try to ping the local address 127.0.0.1 and check the results, but I have not hooked the thin client back up to try this yet.

I started with a fresh install of the XPe SP2 image from the HP website. So I would be surprised if it was a driver error. But I could always reflash the unit and see if that helps.

Any suggestions are more than welcome. I am not a network administrator, so a lot of these tips and tricks are unknown to me.
In a PM you mentioned that you reserve DHCP IP addresses for your different machines (reserve in your router). If I did not misunderstand you, than this could be a problem area.
Meaning if you reserve them by MAC address then perhaps you need to check your router settings.
Apologies in advance if I misunderstood..

[sic0048]

In a PM you mentioned that you reserve DHCP IP addresses for your different machines (reserve in your router). If I did not misunderstand you, than this could be a problem area.
Meaning if you reserve them by MAC address then perhaps you need to check your router settings.
Apologies in advance if I misunderstood..

But I don't reserve an IP address for the device until the router can actually "see" the device. Then I reserve a certain IP address for that device within the router and renew the IP address on the device.

With this particular thin client, the router never sees the device on the network. So I haven't even tried to set a reserve IP address inside the router. It should connect normally to the network.

[bph]

... and I've also tried setting a static IP address. Both ways failed and the device set itself to the APIPA.

That's the odd part. When I set a static IP address there is no failing over to APIPA or anything else. That's the point of a static address. (Not a reservation.) If you are typing a fixed IP into the NIC configuration in windows and then coming back later and finding it missing, or set to APIPA, something is wrong, and I'd bet that it's something in configuration or software, rather than hardware. Of course, I could be wrong, it's hard to tell without the unit in front of me.

[Ron Haley]

Installing a clean XPe image
This step may not be required depending on your device. But if you are unsure how the device has been used in the past, or if you know the image has been modified from its original form, you will want to install a new XPe image to have a clean slate to start with. For example, the units purchased during the group buy were originally used by USAirways and had a custom image that included some proprietary software. Therefore it required a new XPe image to clean everything up and make sure we had all the XPe parts that we needed.

To start, download the XPe image from the HP website (http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareIndex.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodNameId=379363&prodTypeId=12454&prodSeriesId=339208&swLang=13&taskId=135&swEnvOID=1058). Scroll down the page until you find the "Operating System - Enhancements and QFEs" section and click on the download button. (For a t5720 device use this XPe image (http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareDescription.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodTypeId=12454&prodSeriesId=1809592&swItem=vc-65161-1&prodNameId=1809593&swEnvOID=1058&swLang=13&taskId=135&mode=4&idx=0) - the t5700 version does not work on the t 5720). You want to download this to a computer other than the thin client. We will create a bootable USB drive to actually install the OS on the thin client. Once the file is downloaded, install the program on your computer and run it. It will give you the option of creating a ISO file, a bootable USB drive, or unpacking the contents in the directory of your choice. I couldn't find my USB drive anywhere, so I ended up burning a CD and using my USB CD/DVD drive. After creating a CD or USB drive, here are the steps you need to take:
Connect the USB device to the thin client
Restart the thin client and enter the Setup menu by pressing F10 when directed
Choose "Advance BIOS Features" from the menu
Make sure the First Boot Device is set to [USB]
Exit and save (Press ESC and then F10 - per the directions on the screen)
Allow the thin client to continue to boot normally
When asked if you want to restore the OS image and over write the flash memory, select "Y" and confirm
Allow the thin client to load the new image - this takes some time to complete
After the image is finished loading, reboot the thin client and allow it to complete the restore process. This takes approximately 5-10 minutes and your screen will likely be a black screen for the first couple of minutes. The thin client is really working, so make sure you leave it alone. Eventually it will reboot and enter the normal XP desktop.

Reflashing the OS to XPe SP2 is a super easy task. Other than creating the boot device (Cd or USB drive) the process is pretty much automatic.

The Enhanced Write Filter Manager
Before we start trying to modify the OS to allow the IV to be loaded on to the flash drive, we need to understand a little about how the flash drive works. Under normal conditions, there is an "Enhanced Write Filter Manager" (EWFM) that provides a secure environment for thin-client computing by protecting the thin client from undesired flash memory writes (the operating system and functional software components reside in flash memory). The write filter also extends the life of the thin client by preventing excessive flash write activity. It gives the appearance of read-write access to the flash by employing a cache to intercept all flash writes and returning success to the process that requested the I/O.

The intercepted flash writes that are stored in cache are available as long as the thin client remains active, but are lost when you reboot or shut down the unit. To preserve the results of writes to the registry, favorites, cookies, and so forth, you can transfer the contents of the cache to the flash on demand using the Altiris Deployment Solution software or manually using the EWFM.

For our purposes of adding the IV, we'll manually disable the EWFM, so that all future writes during the current boot session are written to the flash with no further caching until reboot. Just remember to re-enable the EWFM after you have made all of your permanent changes or simply reboot the unit before resuming normal activities.

To do this take these steps:
1. Log in as an administrator. Press the 'start' button, and press the "Log Off" button. When the "Log Off Windows" popup appears, hold the 'shift' key and select 'log off' and continue holding the shift button down. This will bring up the log in screen. Enter in User=Administrator & Pwd=Administrator and log back in. If you don't hold the shift button long enough, the thin client will log back into the User profile automatically.
2. Right click the EWFM icon in the system tray (it is the icon that looks like a lock and will probably been green and appear to be locked.
3. Select "Enable" to turn the manager on and prevent permanent writes to the flash memory. Select "Disable" to turn the filter off and allow permanent writes to the flash memory.
4. The thin client should ask to be rebooted. Go ahead and do this. When the system reboots, the lock in the system tray should be open and red in color if the EWFM is disabled.


You can also permanently write to the flash memory by using some simply command lines. This can be useful if you forget to turn off the EWFM and start making some changes. You can "commit" these changed to permanent memory without having to reboot and start over. To do this:
1. Make any changes that you want to save/commit to permanent memory
2. Open the Command Line Prompt (Start > Run > Open > and type in "CMD" in the open field and click "OK")
3. Type ewfmgr c: -commit
4. Other commands include "-disable" which turn off the EWFM filter and "-enable" which turns on the EWFM filter and "-all" which shows the current status of the memory volumes.


Adding Files to the XPe OS - (this step is not required if you have a t5720 and are using the latest XPe version from the HP site).
We need to add a couple of files from the regular XP OS to the XPe OS that is installed on the thin client. The IV installer requires these files and they are normally not installed with XPe. The two files are attrib.exe & dbghelp.dll. They are located in the Windows/System32 folder of a regular XP installation and need to be saved in the same folder on the thin client. Again, make sure you have disabled the EWFM before trying to save these files.

Turning off the HP Sygate Security Agent Firewall
By default, there is a firewall that starts up to "protect" your thin client. However, it seems to prevent communication between the CQC Client and CQC server. So we need to disable the software before trying to install CQC. Log in as Administrator
Right click the Sygate icon in the system tray (it looks like two arrows - one pointing up and one pointing down).
Select "Options"
Under the General tab, uncheck the "Automatically load HP Sygate Security Agent service at startup
Right click the Sygate icon again
Choose "Disable Sygate Security Agent"
Right click the Sygate icon again
Choose "Exit Sygate Agent" and acknowledge.

Optionally, you can remove the Sygate program and even install the Windows Firewall if you feel the need to run a firewall in your situation. Directions on doing this can be found below or in this HP support document (http://bizsupport.austin.hp.com/bc/docs/support/SupportManual/c00572312/c00572312.pdf).

Installing CQC
Now that the EWFM and the Sygate Security program have been disabled, we are ready to install CQC. I ended up moving the installation folder directly to the thin client and installing from there. I did this just to make sure there is enough room to do this. I had no trouble using this method. But you could install from a USB drive, network location, etc. Whatever method you are comfortable with should work fine.

I got a couple of "missing files" notices immeditately after invoking the installer, but the system continued on and I was able to finish the installation without any problems. In my personal situation, I decided to install the IV, the admin interface, and the CQCServer. I had no problems installing or running any of these items. However, several people has experienced a situation where the installer simply quits before finishing (it simply ends without warning or any errors). If this happens to you, please download a new installation package from the CQC site and try again. Most people have gotten through the installation process on the second try if the first try failed. I cannot explain why some people have a problem and others don't. I'm not entirely convinced it is a problem with the thin clients. It could be a corrupt download (ie missing a few bits of information).

After rebooting and opening the IV interface and admin interface and opening a couple of IV screens that have an imbedded internet pages on them, browsing my CD repo, etc, my memory maxed out at 209 mb. So it seems that it will run everything on 256mb. I've checked the flash drive and it seems to only have about 226mb used (after I deleted the installation folder) and 286mb free. It has not been confirmed yet if you can load CQC on only 256mb flash, but there is plenty of room left over for touch screen drivers, etc when you use 512mb flash. In fact, adding more space than 512mb purely overkill for a dedicated CQC device.

If you have installed CQC using the "Stand Alone IV" version, you may need to add the "/Standalone" switch in the IV startup line (found by right clicking the IV icon and selecting "properties").
Thank you for this post. It really helped!!!!!!!!!!!

[bjkiller]

i use HP T5720 hardware for voip pbx asterisk (askozia) and firewall (monowall). last friday morning SageTV server power supply dead and short my UPS. after power back, firewall become up, but pbx NOT. I did not found anything different in BIOS!
I checked both has bios v1.07, there no option (after power on ?) to change it's in bios. i just googled a bit and found new(few years ago) bios 1.10b.
that has included option to change what happend after power restore. so all of you welcome to upgrade.

Becouse I run BSD OS (monowall and askozia) HP does not supply right firmware upgrade software, so i need to make bootable USB stick with DOS and DOS firmware upgrade software.
I use HP boot flash utility to create bootable DOS on flash disk - it's very useful for Firmware upgrades in general.

http://www.bootdisk.com/plan040109/hpflash1.zip

here files with firwmare and software to upgrade for DOS and Windows
http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareDescription.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&swItem=PSG_I21179-105260&jumpid=reg_R1002_USEN

[Ron Haley]

i use HP T5720 hardware for voip pbx asterisk (askozia) and firewall (monowall). last friday morning SageTV server power supply dead and short my UPS. after power back, firewall become up, but pbx NOT. I did not found anything different in BIOS!
I checked both has bios v1.07, there no option (after power on ?) to change it's in bios. i just googled a bit and found new(few years ago) bios 1.10b.
that has included option to change what happend after power restore. so all of you welcome to upgrade.

Becouse I run BSD OS (monowall and askozia) HP does not supply right firmware upgrade software, so i need to make bootable USB stick with DOS and DOS firmware upgrade software.
I use HP boot flash utility to create bootable DOS on flash disk - it's very useful for Firmware upgrades in general.

http://www.bootdisk.com/plan040109/hpflash1.zip

here files with firwmare and software to upgrade for DOS and Windows
http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/SoftwareDescription.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&swItem=PSG_I21179-105260&jumpid=reg_R1002_USEN
Thanks - I'm thinking of using one for asterisk as well. Currently use a standard server. Is 1 GB enough storage to run this effectively? Also, I guess I can add a TDM400 to the box.

[bjkiller]

Thanks - I'm thinking of using one for asterisk as well. Currently use a standard server. Is 1 GB enough storage to run this effectively? Also, I guess I can add a TDM400 to the box.
i run askozia (http://www.askozia.org), i have askozia build that includes CURL(good for automation) and g729.
I have one modem with connected phone line, but i do not happy with line quality.

I have connected SNOM m3 with 8 phonesets, water proof Uniden WXI2077 and DWX207 via HT488 fxs, Doorbell Fon Door Answering System via HT488 fxo.

Most of the calls routed VOIP.

I have basic configuration(256mb ram, 192mb flash):
Apr 3 11:49:08 kernel: avail memory = 215715840 (205 MB)
Apr 3 11:49:08 kernel: real memory = 251592704 (239 MB)

Memory Usage [36012 / 211856 kBytes] 17%

[personalt]

Has anyone used these with USB wifi adapters? Something like this?
http://www.amazon.com/Linksys-WUSB11-Wireless-B-Network-Adapter/dp/B00005AW1H

I hate the idea but I am looking to add a touchpanel in my master bedroom on a wall that would take way too long to fish a wire to.

my concern is if the touchpanel goes to sleep and wakes up does CQC or the wifi have any issues recovering as fast as a wired connection?

[daddyd]

I have 2 T5720s running off a Dlink USB Wireless G Adaptor.

http://www.amazon.com/D-Link-Wireless-Adapter-802-11g-54Mbps/dp/B000FJJASO/ref=dp_cp_ob_e_title_0

It works fine, no noticeable lag with start up from standby (sleep).

[personalt]

A point of reference for anyone hooking these up to ELO touchpanels. At least in my case when I hooked it up via USB control to start the panel was moving left when I was moving right. I tried the align but it didnt seem to do much of anything. I ended ujp having to hook up a serial cable to align it, after that I was able to reconnect the USB. Very odd... Lost at least an hour thinking I had a bad touchpanel.

[beelzerob]

A point of reference for anyone hooking these up to ELO touchpanels. At least in my case when I hooked it up via USB control to start the panel was moving left when I was moving right. I tried the align but it didnt seem to do much of anything. I ended ujp having to hook up a serial cable to align it, after that I was able to reconnect the USB. Very odd... Lost at least an hour thinking I had a bad touchpanel.

Glad I happened upon this....exact same thing is happening to mine. First USB one I've tried using, so no wonder I've not had this problem before.

Does anyone out there have a solution for a photo-slideshow/screensaver for the 5700? It's not a part of windows embedded, so wondering what the next best thing is. If this doesn't work well as a picture frame thingy, the wife will probably be unhappy.

[bjkiller]

Glad I happened upon this....exact same thing is happening to mine. First USB one I've tried using, so no wonder I've not had this problem before.

Does anyone out there have a solution for a photo-slideshow/screensaver for the 5700? It's not a part of windows embedded, so wondering what the next best thing is. If this doesn't work well as a picture frame thingy, the wife will probably be unhappy.

use sagetv client, it's has this feature buildin.

[beelzerob]

Well I take it back...I plugged in the serial, it went through the calibration fine, and responded correctly....then unplugged the serial and back to the USB, and it's still reversed and won't go through the cal process. :-(

[beelzerob]

use sagetv client, it's has this feature buildin.

The 5700 will handle the sage tv client? Seems a bit overkill for just a photo slideshow.

[personalt]

When you calibrated it, did the 4 squares come up where you have to touch the X? When I first hit calibrate using the USB I didnt get those Xs the button just depressed and I got the impression it did recalibrate on its own. When I went to serial that is when I saw the X. So maybe it isnt so much the serial or USB but you need to see the Xs. If you dont get it I can take a look on my desktop share for the drivers that i used and PM them.



Well I take it back...I plugged in the serial, it went through the calibration fine, and responded correctly....then unplugged the serial and back to the USB, and it's still reversed and won't go through the cal process. :-(

[beelzerob]

When I go to calibrate with the USB connected, the mouse DOES track with my finger, but it's that left/right switched problem. So, when I can manage to click on the Calibrate button, I get a red target in the upper left. However, no amount of pressing on the screen will make it go to the next target, and it eventually times out. So, only when it is actually calibrating (Press from a normal position, etc), it's like the touch function doesn't work at all. I have to wait for the test to timeout, or hit escape on the keyboard.

Switching to the serial cable, it works fine, through all phases.

[beelzerob]

Well, I'm having issues with my cqc PC, and so while I'm in the process of rebuilding, I'm once again considering moving the server to the HP5700. The downside is I won't be able to get TTS out of it, but I can send the TTS to the kitchen PC and the result will be the same.

So, before I begin to try this, I'm just checking again...should this be doable?

[bjkiller]

Well, I'm having issues with my cqc PC, and so while I'm in the process of rebuilding, I'm once again considering moving the server to the HP5700. The downside is I won't be able to get TTS out of it, but I can send the TTS to the kitchen PC and the result will be the same.

So, before I begin to try this, I'm just checking again...should this be doable?
what the issue with TTS? I use 5730 as CQC server for a few months already. it's very nice. i am very happy with this. i do not use TTS, but i use list of things in my signature. tell me how to test TTS - i can do it.

[beelzerob]

Well, the only issue I'm aware of is that Windows TTS simply isn't a part of the 5700 embedded image. From what I understand, it is in the 5720+ clients.

So, to check, all you'd have to do is go to Control Panel and see if you have a Speech icon and a TTS tab within that.

I know the 5720 and 5730 have the horsepower to handle the CQC server...I guess I'll be the first to see if the 5700 has it!

[bjkiller]

Well, the only issue I'm aware of is that Windows TTS simply isn't a part of the 5700 embedded image. From what I understand, it is in the 5720+ clients.

So, to check, all you'd have to do is go to Control Panel and see if you have a Speech icon and a TTS tab within that.

I know the 5720 and 5730 have the horsepower to handle the CQC server...I guess I'll be the first to see if the 5700 has it!

copy c:\WINDOWS\inf\sapi5.inf from your regular Windows XP to your 5720 and try to install this inf file. when it's will be ask files, point source of opened Windows XP disk upgraded to same SP as your embedded os.

I did same a few months ago to get support for MS Firewall GUI and DVB support (for Sage). I plan to run SageTV on Windows XP Embdeeded with PAX and 3GB RAM.

[personalt]

Anyone clone the image off one thin client and installed it on a second? The first one I set up runs fine. I set up a second one from scratch(I thought in the same way). The second keeps running out of virtual memory even when I am not doing anything.

The only known differences are the 2nd one has a wireless driver. I plan to run a cat5 to it this weekend and kill the wireless but if that doesnt do it I would like to just copy the first one I built, install on second and just change PC name and IP .

I know you can do the default windows install from the CF card, I was just wondering if anyone has rolled their own install by copying the files from a good one?

[bjkiller]

Anyone clone the image off one thin client and installed it on a second? The first one I set up runs fine. I set up a second one from scratch(I thought in the same way). The second keeps running out of virtual memory even when I am not doing anything.

The only known differences are the 2nd one has a wireless driver. I plan to run a cat5 to it this weekend and kill the wireless but if that doesnt do it I would like to just copy the first one I built, install on second and just change PC name and IP .

I know you can do the default windows install from the CF card, I was just wondering if anyone has rolled their own install by copying the files from a good one?

May be driver buggy, I even install this image on non HP computer...with 4Gb RAM (but it's see only 3GB with PAX)...and try to run on it SAGE server.

This Image allows you to convert computer into appliance.
btw: i run CQC server on such computer.

[potts.mike]

Anyone clone the image off one thin client and installed it on a second? The first one I set up runs fine. I set up a second one from scratch(I thought in the same way). The second keeps running out of virtual memory even when I am not doing anything.

The only known differences are the 2nd one has a wireless driver. I plan to run a cat5 to it this weekend and kill the wireless but if that doesnt do it I would like to just copy the first one I built, install on second and just change PC name and IP .

I know you can do the default windows install from the CF card, I was just wondering if anyone has rolled their own install by copying the files from a good one?

I havent done this with the hp thin clients but I did it with two webdt tablets. In the windows section of webdt.org there are instructions and files that allow you to use windows 98 with ghost to image them.

[kayemsi]

I had a trojan virus attack my thin client, so I had to flash back to the hp image and start following the instructions. Note that I had no real problems getting this setup the first time last year following the instructions and have installed CQC and updated it several times with no issues as well as using RDP.

This time around, since the attack I removed the Sygate Security agent and installed the latest Windows Firewall from the HP site. I did this before trying to install CQC as I thought I remembered reading that the CQC install would setup the right exceptions so I thought I should have that installed first.

I now find that it fails the test finding the master server during CQC install and I cannot connect to the MS via RDP. I can map a network drive to the shareddocs on the master server by name. That is where I ran the installs from. I can also ping the master server by name with no issues. I had disabled windows firewall after the first unsuccessful attempt at installation (and RDP test).

Any suggestions?

Edit: After adding the master server to the hosts file and rebooting a couple of time, I now have CQC reinstalled and working (except the weather radar, which stays a black screen (Flash 6)). RDP is working again as well.

[sic0048]

Trojan Virus? Wow. Rebooting the thin client didn't help? Was the EWF locked at the time? I would have thought that if the lock was on, a simple reboot would have reverted back to the last imaged actually saved on the memory. That would have been pre-virus.

That is one reason the thin clients can be so nice - because if you screw them up, a simple reboot will usually fix them.

I load the OS, CQC, flash, etc and get it all in a basic working condition. Then I commit all the changes permanently by committing the EWF. That way any time the system is rebooted, it will go back to that original image.

[potts.mike]

Also a good idea to image it once in working state. Then its really easy to get back to where you want to be.

[kayemsi]

I had forgotten to relock the EWF last time I upgraded the CQC install. After I got it working again, (but still apparently need a flash later than the default version 6), I locked the EWF and re-enabled Windows Firewall. Later last night I got another virus attack, then I just restarted and everything was fine.

What flash version did you use on your thin client and does it show the animated radar maps?

How did you save an image of your working state?

[sic0048]

As far as flash goes, I just went to the Adobe site (http://www.adobe.com/software/flash/about/) and downloaded the latest version. It does run the animated radar pages, but I am currently using a t5720 for my main display. However, I know the radar worked on the t5700's - the only difference being perhaps a slower initial widget loading time.

I do not make any hard copy of my final machine image. But committing and locking the EWF will effectively save that hard copy on the permanent memory of the machine. So unless you had some problem with the memory hardware itself, the image should be fine on the memory.

You can leave the EWF in a locked state, and simply commit the changes when you load in a new program like Flash or update CQC to a newer version (right click the green lock icon in the system menu and select commit). That way the machine should be protected all the time. Just make sure you don't commit the changes if there is a virus - otherwise you'll have to start from scratch again. :-)

Good luck.

[beelzerob]

Indeed, I have had moving weather maps on my 5700, and it is indeed pretty slow to load at first, and while the animation is definitely as smooth or quick as I'd like, it is certainly acceptable.

I think I also just used the latest flash available.

[beelzerob]

As for imaging.....didn't lesbib (the original 5700 pioneer) say that he just pretty much setup one 5700 and then copied that image onto all his other 5700's? Just curious if anyone knows how that was done...sure would make setup a tad easier.

[potts.mike]

I did this with a pair of webdt tablets, worked like a charm.

[sic0048]

As for imaging.....didn't lesbib (the original 5700 pioneer) say that he just pretty much setup one 5700 and then copied that image onto all his other 5700's? Just curious if anyone knows how that was done...sure would make setup a tad easier.

Actually now that you say that, I think there is an option with the HP software that comes installed to create an image like that. You must be logged in as the Administrator to be able to see those "extra" programs, but it should be there under the Control Panel. I don't remember the exact name however.

[lesbib]

I don't know about the other models but the t5720's come with a license for the Symantec Altiris software. This allows you to remotely manage your thin clients, including taking a master image/copy of one and rolling it to other thin clients. It is fairly handy if you have more than one thin client.

[beelzerob]

Well, no one said it couldn't be done, so I tried using a 5700 as my cqc main server. However, after the apparently successful install, I got several errors about servers not being able to start up. Since then, the 5700 isn't responding....so I'm guessing it can't handle what's being demanded of it??